Groups
Corporate Recruiters Discussions « back to group
-
All,
I'll try to keep this short and simple. We recently landed some big projects, but staffing won't begin for a few months. Word got out to 3rd party recruiters and, of course, my phone started ringing. One external recruiter in-particular sent me a resume of a great candidate, but we have no contract in place and his assistance was not solicited. I'm always open to good candidates so I told him I would accept this specific candidate, but to not do anymore work on it and not to send anymore candidates until I had a chance to rake through the local market.
My dilemma: I spoke with his candidate and asked the typical "who do you know?" question. His candidate mentioned 2 people. Within 5 minutes of getting off the phone w/ the candidate, the external recruiter emailed saying "I've already spoken to the 2 referrals my candidate spoke of and they are aware of your company/need... let me know if you would like me to fwd their info".
So... do I bite the bullet and accept this (don't want to)? I'd like to tell him, if we end up hiring the first candidate you forwarded, I will pay your fee, but the others are fair game since I told you to back-off in the first place. I want to be fair, but I have a job to do at the same time.
I'm interested to know everyones thoughts!! Thanks.
14 replies
Log in or register to post a reply.
-
IF you had an agreement in place would it be okay to source agency candidates prior to them being hired?
Your answer to that will show where you stand ethically.
IMHO you entered into a verbal agreement as soon as you agreed to speak with the candidate. You knew the source, you agreed to speak to the candidate and you knew that there was a fee involved.
-
Well first off I make it my practice that I NEVER accept a candidate without an agreement. When an agency sends me a canddiate out of the blue without having a contract I state to them that if they want to get paid that they never send me a candidate unless we already have a contract. We even have additional authorizations for each project so even agencies we work with that have a master agreement with us, they cannot send us candidates unless it has been approved with an additional authorization stating the specifics of the project.
But for your current delimma, I agree with your last statement and I would pay the agency for the candidate that you already spoke with that came directly from them, but you are under no obligation to pay them for candidates that you have not received from that agency. While it may be the most ethical thing to do and would put you in better standings with that agency, it is their own fault first of all for sending you a candidate when there isn't even a contract in place. So they started off the relationship with a big faux paus in my book. -You have the referrals names, they are fair game.
-
Hi Scott
I am a recruiter -and believe very strongly in the power of collaborative networks for close to 18yrs now. Infact, I have over 400 plus associates across the world -courtesy a firm that has been in existence for over 52 yrs!!
The issue is simple- "BUT FOR" the 'external recruiter in particular' , you would not have got the leads -not just the 'first candidate' but also the further referrals. So, its an open shut case :-)!
Personally, I do not think you can hold yourself on an ethical stand- if you had chosen to 'call the first candidate' -even though you knew the staffing wouldnt begin anytime now. Can you answer why you even had a dilemma :)?
When in doubt, get to the basics- "Do unto others what you want done unto you"
Cheers-have a great week ahead
AK
www.joboptions.blogspot.com
www.optionsindia.com
-
Scott,
You shouldn't think this is an all or none proposition. One of the most important things to remember is to maintain good relationships with your partners and clients. I suggest you think creatively about this. If you:
1) said "no more" candidates"
2) no contract / agreement is in place
3) obtained the names though the candidate (but would not have the names if not for candidate#1)
Go back to your agency and reiterate that there is no agreement. Provide full disclosure that you have the other names and how you obtained them. You need to drive home with the agency you do not want any more resumes unless there is an agreement in place.
In an effort of being ethical and based on keeping good relations, offer to pay the full fee for the 1st candidate but make a separate agreement on the other 2 to pay a very small fee (if the others are placed regardless of the status of candidate#1) It is important for you to be clear this is a good-faith effort and you value the ongoing relationship.
Don't put anything in writing until you have a firm verbal agreement regarding the 2 candidates- then draft a separate agreement for those people.
The agency may not be pleased but won’t turn down the offer. Technically, you don't have to pay anything. They know it. If not, remind them. The agency may not like it but will respect you trying to do what's right by all and acknowledging their efforts with a small fee.
Good luck!
-
Scott,
Bottom line is that you opened up that can of worms when you decided to follow up on an unsolicited resume. The minute you engaged the 3rd party recruiter about this candidate you entered into a quasi-contract with the 3rd party recruiter; the terms of the agreement or contract were just not finalized. The 3rd party recruiter became the catalyst for this candidate considering your opportunity as well as the other referrals. Rationalizing it in any other way is both lying to yourself and setting you and your company up for a suit. It sound like this 3rd-party recruiter may be a go-to person that you could have a relationship with for some time to come. This is what doing business is about and besides, the money does not come from your paycheck. I think you need to do a bit of an ego check.
-
I would agree with the position to pay for the initial candidate, but not for the referrals. You are paid to be smart enough to know the right questions to ask and I've not yet seen a fee agreement stating that I get paid for any candidates generated by my customer's discussions with my candidate.
I've seen enough people who wouldn't even pay for the first candidate, saying that no agreement was in place.
Best Regards from Germany,
Edward
-
Edward, not paying for referrals opens the door to fraud . . . constantly inviting candidates for intervies with the appearance of intention to hire but with no other purpose than to obtain referrals. It was one of the points we made in our cases. We are not in the business and referring people to organization to be sourced. We are retained by companies, on a retained or contingency basis, to refer candidates to evaluated and assessed for hiring by that company. YOU WILL NOTICE I DID NOT WRITE, "EVALUATED, HIRED AND SOURCED."
Best wishes,
-
Hello Jeff,
I see your point and on a purely ethical level would give you 60% of the argument. I just don't quite agree that the recruiter doesn't carry partial ownership, thus potential consequences. I like his aggressive aproach, but his work appears to me to be sloppy - candidate names should NEVER appear until a contract is in place. Thus, paying for the first - unsolicited - candidate should suffice.
I've run into sufficient quantities of people who would have a hearty laugh and pay the recruiter nothing at all, so I truly respect Scott's approach.
Best Regards from Germany,
Edward
-
I am a third party recruiter.
I believe that because you aer asking for advice, on some level, you know that the originating recruiter is due compensation. He/She did not send the resume with a note that said, "Feel free to source my candidates and not pay me." He sent it with the expectation that he would be paid for his work.
And, I want to make a general statement.
If I refer a candidate to a job at a client, I expect to be paid for my work.
Respectfully, Scott, it is important to give the appearance of honesty when you work for a firm like yours and never place you or the firm at any risk for being criticized for inappropriate behavior. The few dollars are not worth it to Cummins.
(I have already won suits against firms that behaved as your inquiry would suggest).
I hope I have been helpful; my intention was to neither be critical or nasty.
Thank you for having the sense to ask for advice.
Best wishes,
-
I would say that you already sourced these names on your own? You did, right?
-
Yes and no. I asked the candidate for names. The candidate was referred to me by the 3rd party guy who he knew. That's the yes part. The no part... I wouldn't know those names (maybe eventually through other means) if I didn't speak to the candidate. I've never heard of a fee by osmosis.
I'm probably going to tell him that the 2 referred candidates are mine, I'm just making sure this is acceptable as I've never come across the situation... came across plenty other situations, but never this one.
-
Scott,
I hope you are able to get to the best thing for all involved here. My interagency agreement does specifically state that any referal of my candidate to other agencies or companies resulting in a hire will cause a fee to be owed; likewise any referal from the candidate I submit resulting in a hire will cause a fee to be owed. The agreement is reciprocal and I honor it. You should have made sure that your contract was in place before you made the call. The other recruiter knows you have those names otherwise you would not have been given the information.
Good Luck with it
-
As a rule I reject all unsolicited 3rd party resume and send them a response indicating that we do not accept unsolicted agency submittals and that if the candidate has their resume or contact information posted anywhere on the web (i.e. dice, facebook, linkedin, etc.) and I contact the candidate and hire him/her, that the agency will not be due any fee.
By accepting the candidate from the agency and talking with him/her, your "osmosis" assumption is probably right as most agencies will attest that any referrals you get from one of their candidates are also their resource and you could owe a fee if you hire anyone referred by the candidate.
Carl
-
Hi Scott - I think you need to pay for the first candidate but not the referrals.
You might want to take a look at RecruitAlliance.com. It's a free site for Corporate recruiters. It helps you manage Headhunter resumes.
Good luck
Bill
-
